--- Log opened Sun Mar 27 00:00:43 2011
00:02 < mcallan> i'm done for the night, c. cu soon
00:03 < conseo> cu
16:07 < conseo> mcallan: do you think that we can add semantic map support to the pollwiki? we could then store the coordinates directly on the users page, instead of querying google (which could still be done as a fallback + automatic setting of the property in the wiki)?
16:08 < conseo> the cool thing is that it allows a) to integrate maps in wiki documents itself and b) to query the data dependant on geo-locals
16:14 < conseo> this would allow to decorate the bites for polls and positions as well with geolocals (and even not only one but several of them maybe even including shapes of areas [dunno yet])
16:15 < conseo> but that is not what i want to do atm. i just wanted to mention that storing the geolocals in the wiki might be better than only storing address data there
16:52 < mcallan> conseo: i'm thinking of putting crossforum theatre inside of Votorola's home page. that would make it an integral part of the "big hunt for users". frankly, that's what it was designed for anyway.
16:52 < conseo> sure, but that doesn't conflict with semantic maps, does it?
16:53 < mcallan> the upshot is that i might be working in the theatre again very soon, and then the geolocals will be a priority.
16:53 < conseo> it is an extension for semantic media-wiki
16:53 < mcallan> what conflict with waht?
16:54 < conseo> mcallan: i am not even imposing that geolocals are priority, i am just saying that if we allow them to be stored in the wiki, querying them will be easy and flexible and will allow us to run the Geomapper not only for users but also polls easily
16:54 < conseo> but it is an infrastructural thing which has also to do how we store user's registration
16:58 < mcallan> i just haven't run into a problem with geolocals. again, what problem are you trying to solve, and how is it affecting you? just so i understand
16:58 < mcallan> (my proposal about putting the theatre into the home page is a separate thing)
17:00 < conseo> ok. i am trying to solve the most efficient storage of geolocals
17:00 < conseo> the user registry is only a special case. more interesting than the users' location is the poll's location
17:00 < conseo> or related area
17:02 < conseo> seems like my issues were not related to multithreading but rather wrong understanding of the irc protocol/irclib code changes
17:02 < conseo> that seems to be the reason the bot hangup
17:04 < mcallan> we haven't yet hit the problem of geolocating a poll. when we do, it will boil down to geolocating divisions, which is a property of polls: http://u.zelea.com/w/Category:Division
17:05 < mcallan> i'm not sure our geolocation methods are inefficient... but as i say, i'll probably be revisiting this very soon, and will look again at your suggestion (geolocals rather than geohandles in wiki)
17:07 < mcallan> this explains more about how polls relate to divisions (and thence to geomapping): http://u.zelea.com/w/Property:Division
17:10 < conseo> ok maybe tagging divisions is a very good idea: http://mapping.referata.com/wiki/Semantic_Maps
17:10 < conseo> just for reference
17:26 < mcallan> we looked at maps and sem-maps extensions before. i think we decided that the mapping UI is better done outside of mediaWiki.
17:28 < mcallan> conseo: i think crossforum's maps might be able to do what you want (but not sure, yet)
17:28 < conseo> it is not about maps only, it also adds a geo local semantic type to semantic media wiki
17:29 < conseo> (which is not in there by default)
17:29 < conseo> i am not saying that maps should go to the wiki, it is just a possibility since it is generic support in our db
17:31 < mcallan> hmmm... should we trust him, or not? http://u.zelea.com:8080/v/w/Votespace?p=G!p!vohall&u=4consensus%20WebDe
17:31 < conseo> don't think so, i know him, he is a terrible troll ;-)
17:36 < mcallan> ... but he's voting for me
17:40 < mcallan> done, your vote should appear in the next count: http://u.zelea.com/w/User:4consensus_WebDe
17:41 < conseo> makes it sense to trust you back? or should i add thomas?
17:42 < conseo> i mean add my signature to thomas' page
17:44 < mcallan> you could, if it doesn't look like he has enough trusters.  he's a shady character, too ;-)
17:44 < mcallan> co: re the gibberish at top here: http://u.zelea.com/w/User:4consensus_WebDe/De/p/PM
17:45 < mcallan> the problem and solution are explained here: http://u.zelea.com/w/Type:Text
17:47 < mcallan> conseo: actually, i'm not sure you'll be able to vote. geolocals come into play *here*
17:49 < conseo> ok, but you are master right? you can extend trust to anybody even if you are not in range (or what do you mean?)
17:49 < conseo> what do you mean with gibberish
17:49 < conseo> ?
17:50 < mcallan> i mean the "Alle Ausbildungen, die zu einem staatlich anerkannten Abschluss f\303\274hren m\303\274ssen mit offenen Lehrmaterialien zug\303\244nglich gemacht werden."
17:50 < mcallan> u see?
17:51 < conseo> ah ok, me is blind :-)
17:51 < mcallan> to get in the voter register (and be eligible to vote in G/p/vohall), i think you need to follow these instructions: http://u.zelea.com/w/Sys/t/register
17:52 < mcallan> either that, or pretend you live in an existing political area, like Tor or DD
17:53 < mcallan> i'll force a trust trace + count, and we'll see...
17:53 < conseo> DD is described as Dresden and not germany
17:53 < conseo> although the postal code is unified all over Germany 
17:54 < mcallan> nice votrace --churn && nice vocount # ...
17:54 < mcallan> u register locally, not nationally
17:55 < conseo> and DD is toplevel? Not something like De/Sa/DD ?
17:56 < conseo> De -> Germany, Sa -> Sachsen, DD -> Dresden
17:57 < mcallan> DD and MA will have their own independent pollwiki/streetwiki
17:58 < mcallan> Sa and ?Ba will have their own pollwikis, which will aggregate their voter lists from the registers=streetwikis of all cities etc. in the state
17:58 < mcallan> (actually, its the vote-servers that do the list aggregation)
17:59 < mcallan> hah, no matter: http://u.zelea.com:8080/v/w/Votespace?p=G!p!vohall&u=4consensus%20WebDe
17:59 < mcallan> conseo: trust rules, i guess
18:00 < conseo> why does it work?
18:02 < mcallan> for one, because you have trust: http://u.zelea.com/system/host/u/home/v/votorola/out/votrace/_readyTrace_report/_mountedTrace/_default.xml
18:03 < conseo> ok, so you can cast trust to anybody, even if they don't have valid geolocals?
18:04 < conseo> i am just asking why a "1" is there
18:05 < mcallan> the 1 says you have trust. if truster doesn't think u need geolocals to have trust, then it's ok.
18:05 < mcallan> question is, what does the poll require in terms of voter eligibility...
18:07 < mcallan> ... and (2) what does the poll's division require? ...
18:08 < mcallan> (1) poll requires trust level of at least 1: http://u.zelea.com/w/G/p/vohall
18:08 < mcallan> (2) division requires nothing: http://u.zelea.com/w/G
18:10 < conseo> ok, i understand that (have read that part of the streetwiki docs lately again). i am just wondering how i can gain trust if i am not in the range of your trust "radius". 2km or sth. you have mentioned in the docs i think
18:11 < mcallan> (ultimately, the answers are all in the .js config files, because this is all config) ...
18:11 < conseo> ok
18:12 < mcallan> i think this is currently the only division that formally requires residence (tho it doesn't informally say so), because it has a Division property: http://u.zelea.com/w/Tor/riding/Trinity-Spadina
18:12 < conseo> ok
18:13 < mcallan> conseo: see function trustBar(): http://u.zelea.com/system/host/u/home/v/votorola/trust/trustserver-run.js
18:13 < mcallan> no range restrictions are currently in effect
18:16 < mcallan> frankly this stuff is not easy. but no matter, it works. and only the admin/devs need to understand it.
18:17 < conseo> if( 1 == 1 ) return; :D
18:18 < mcallan> skill testing question
19:06 < conseo> test-xfb: channels
19:06 < test-xfb> Currently monitoring: #metagov
21:29 < conseo> heck again a fault when parsing my mail to mailish-username...
21:29 < conseo> sry
--- Log closed Mon Mar 28 00:00:57 2011